WakeOfAshesPosts: 21,665destroyer of motherfuckers
You know the last time the United States legally declared war was on June 5, 1942
Yep, I am aware. That doesn't make it justified for a president to shit on the constitution and not.... Do you disagree?
Funny story - Have you heard the 'conspiracy theory' surrounding WW2? It actually isnt much of a conspiracy theory because there is a LOT of evidence to support it, but it kinda is because people don't talk about it often.
Anyways... FDR wanted into WW2 in a bad way. He felt it was our moral obligation to help the allies. And he felt that if we didnt join the war then we soon would when Hitler started his invasion of us. Regardless, at the time the people were very much against joining the war... And so FDR moved those ships into Perl Harbor to give the Japanese the illusion that we were getting ready to invade them. They also allowed communications to be 'accidentally' intercepted that would give the Japanese the illusion that we were about to invade. Basically FDR started talking shit and pumping up his chest to make it look like he wanted a fight... and the Japanese took the bait and struck first. Which was exactly the crisis FDR needed to get the people and congress on board with joining the war. funny huh? FDR basically caused Perl Harbor. Sure he might not have known they were really going to hit him for talking shit, but I am sure he suspected they would and he defiantly wanted them too.
This is my whole thing about conspiracy theories, if they were actually true, wouldn't we all know about it and have overwhelming evidence to back it up?
You know the last time the United States legally declared war was on June 5, 1942
Yep, I am aware. That doesn't make it justified for a president to shit on the constitution and not.... Do you disagree?
Funny story - Have you heard the 'conspiracy theory' surrounding WW2? It actually isnt much of a conspiracy theory because there is a LOT of evidence to support it, but it kinda is because people don't talk about it often.
Anyways... FDR wanted into WW2 in a bad way. He felt it was our moral obligation to help the allies. And he felt that if we didnt join the war then we soon would when Hitler started his invasion of us. Regardless, at the time the people were very much against joining the war... And so FDR moved those ships into Perl Harbor to give the Japanese the illusion that we were getting ready to invade them. They also allowed communications to be 'accidentally' intercepted that would give the Japanese the illusion that we were about to invade. Basically FDR started talking shit and pumping up his chest to make it look like he wanted a fight... and the Japanese took the bait and struck first. Which was exactly the crisis FDR needed to get the people and congress on board with joining the war. funny huh? FDR basically caused Perl Harbor. Sure he might not have known they were really going to hit him for talking shit, but I am sure he suspected they would and he defiantly wanted them too.
I have heard that story, but not sure how much I believe he wanted or thought that many men would die that day, if he thought the attack would have been that big I bet he would have not done that. Then again I could be wrong, or delusional, as FDR is my favorite president ever.
WakeOfAshesPosts: 21,665destroyer of motherfuckers
Whether we like it or not, we ARE the police of the world. We're the most powerful nation, and with that comes more responsibility.
That is something I disagree on. If you do assume we are the police of the world though, I feel as though you MUST be in support of bombing Libya, and MUST be in support of the Iraq invasion. Both cases have/had dictators that are committing crimes against humanity in the same vein as Hitler did.
I really feel there is no need to further debate the US being the police of the world. I doubt I could change your mind on that point, and I know you couldnt change mine.
This is my whole thing about conspiracy theories, if they were actually true, wouldn't we all know about it and have overwhelming evidence to back it up?
There are agencies which hide information from us so we don't get concrete proof of stuff like this, that is why Obama is having a hard time keeping his promises. He says he will do this, then he gets in office and finds out exactly why we are there and boom, doesn't keep his promises.
WakeOfAshesPosts: 21,665destroyer of motherfuckers
This is my whole thing about conspiracy theories, if they were actually true, wouldn't we all know about it and have overwhelming evidence to back it up?
There is overwhelming evidence. There is no logical reasoning for FDR to move the fleet into Perl Harbor like he did. And there is telegrams in evidence that supports that he was goading the Japanese.
As Primus said though... there is no way he could have known how bad it would be. And I agree with that comment. I am not saying he knew the punch was coming and allowed us to take it. I am only saying that he talked shit to the Japanese to provoke them to hit us so he could get the support to join the war.
maybe this is a better analogy... some dude walks up and starts talking shit to some gang banger so the gang banger will hit him and go to jail. Instead of hitting him the dude pulls out a gun and starts shooting. see? I'm not saying that FDR knew he had a gun, just saying he was provoking the Japanese to get the support to join the war.
That is something I disagree on. If you do assume we are the police of the world though, I feel as though you MUST be in support of bombing Libya, and MUST be in support of the Iraq invasion. Both cases have/had dictators that are committing crimes against humanity in the same vein as Hitler did.
I really feel there is no need to further debate the US being the police of the world. I doubt I could change your mind on that point, and I know you couldnt change mine.
I don't support the Iraq war for other reasons. I think we could of handled things differently there. I can totally see where you're coming from, though. I just wouldn't go as far as to compare them to Hitler.
There are agencies which hide information from us so we don't get concrete proof of stuff like this, that is why Obama is having a hard time keeping his promises. He says he will do this, then he gets in office and finds out exactly why we are there and boom, doesn't keep his promises.
I understand this, I just REALLY hate conspiracy theories, lol. They're ridiculous.
And you have got to realize there is so much about our president we don't know about. We don't know who or what he deals with every day. Of course he has to keep some things hush hush. All presidents have. and plus, most people agree (from polls I've seen) that some things are better left secret to our government because of the fear and chaos it would cause the people. It would make problems harder to deal with.
This is my whole thing about conspiracy theories, if they were actually true, wouldn't we all know about it and have overwhelming evidence to back it up?
There is overwhelming evidence. There is no logical reasoning for FDR to move the fleet into Perl Harbor like he did. And there is telegrams in evidence that supports that he was goading the Japanese.
As Primus said though... there is no way he could have known how bad it would be. And I agree with that comment. I am not saying he knew the punch was coming and allowed us to take it. I am only saying that he talked shit to the Japanese to provoke them to hit us so he could get the support to join the war.
maybe this is a better analogy... some dude walks up and starts talking shit to some gang banger so the gang banger will hit him and go to jail. Instead of hitting him the dude pulls out a gun and starts shooting. see? I'm not saying that FDR knew he had a gun, just saying he was provoking the Japanese to get the support to join the war.
I know what you're saying. I'd have to look into this myself though.
Edit: I do have to admit, this is much more believable and plausible than the usual crap I get from like, 9/11 conspiracies and those stupid JFK ones. :-))
WakeOfAshesPosts: 21,665destroyer of motherfuckers
that was just as stupid as saying the US government blew up the towers on 9/11
Except there is a lot of evidence to support FDR doing this. Some 'experts' even think he did the right thing by doing this. Had we not joined the war, it might have just been us against Hitler and we probably would have fallen.
WakeOfAshesPosts: 21,665destroyer of motherfuckers
That is something I disagree on. If you do assume we are the police of the world though, I feel as though you MUST be in support of bombing Libya, and MUST be in support of the Iraq invasion. Both cases have/had dictators that are committing crimes against humanity in the same vein as Hitler did.
I really feel there is no need to further debate the US being the police of the world. I doubt I could change your mind on that point, and I know you couldnt change mine.
I don't support the Iraq war for other reasons. I think we could of handled things differently there. I can totally see where you're coming from, though. I just wouldn't go as far as to compare them to Hitler.
The fact that Saddam dropped biological weapons on innocent people to chart the weapons effectiveness, makes me think the analogy is solid. You know that Saddam and his crew would often pick up women they found attractive and take them back and rape and/or murder them?
The fact that Saddam dropped biological weapons on innocent people to chart the weapons effectiveness, makes me think the analogy is solid. You know that Saddam and his crew would often pick up women they found attractive and take them back and rape and/or murder them?
My mistake, thought you were comparing our presidents to Hitler. Sorry about that!
Yeah, I can definitely agree that Saddam was just as bad.
Speaking of interesting theories, did anyone watch that movie Confederate States Of America a couple years ago? It is about if the Confederacy had won the civil war and was really interesting.
Speaking of interesting theories, did anyone watch that movie Confederate States Of America a couple years ago? It is about if the Confederacy had won the civil war and was really interesting.
Speaking of interesting theories, did anyone watch that movie Confederate States Of America a couple years ago? It is about if the Confederacy had won the civil war and was really interesting.
i watched it a little bit, it was kinda cool
I like the part where they get to World War 2 and Hitler tries to ally with America and the president at the time tries to convince Hitler to enslave the jews instead of killing them. That probably would have happened.
Speaking of interesting theories, did anyone watch that movie Confederate States Of America a couple years ago? It is about if the Confederacy had won the civil war and was really interesting.
i watched it a little bit, it was kinda cool
I like the part where they get to World War 2 and Hitler tries to ally with America and the president at the time tries to convince Hitler to enslave the jews instead of killing them. That probably would have happened.
Speaking of interesting theories, did anyone watch that movie Confederate States Of America a couple years ago? It is about if the Confederacy had won the civil war and was really interesting.
i watched it a little bit, it was kinda cool
I like the part where they get to World War 2 and Hitler tries to ally with America and the president at the time tries to convince Hitler to enslave the jews instead of killing them. That probably would have happened.
It goes into some intense detail, going between the alternate and actual universe a lot. It feels like a documentary when watching it. At the end they go over real world products that are sold in other countries or in America that are very racist, a good example is Darkie Toothpaste.
Comments
Funny story - Have you heard the 'conspiracy theory' surrounding WW2? It actually isnt much of a conspiracy theory because there is a LOT of evidence to support it, but it kinda is because people don't talk about it often.
Anyways... FDR wanted into WW2 in a bad way. He felt it was our moral obligation to help the allies. And he felt that if we didnt join the war then we soon would when Hitler started his invasion of us. Regardless, at the time the people were very much against joining the war... And so FDR moved those ships into Perl Harbor to give the Japanese the illusion that we were getting ready to invade them. They also allowed communications to be 'accidentally' intercepted that would give the Japanese the illusion that we were about to invade. Basically FDR started talking shit and pumping up his chest to make it look like he wanted a fight... and the Japanese took the bait and struck first. Which was exactly the crisis FDR needed to get the people and congress on board with joining the war. funny huh? FDR basically caused Perl Harbor. Sure he might not have known they were really going to hit him for talking shit, but I am sure he suspected they would and he defiantly wanted them too.
I really feel there is no need to further debate the US being the police of the world. I doubt I could change your mind on that point, and I know you couldnt change mine.
As Primus said though... there is no way he could have known how bad it would be. And I agree with that comment. I am not saying he knew the punch was coming and allowed us to take it. I am only saying that he talked shit to the Japanese to provoke them to hit us so he could get the support to join the war.
maybe this is a better analogy... some dude walks up and starts talking shit to some gang banger so the gang banger will hit him and go to jail. Instead of hitting him the dude pulls out a gun and starts shooting. see? I'm not saying that FDR knew he had a gun, just saying he was provoking the Japanese to get the support to join the war.
I understand this, I just REALLY hate conspiracy theories, lol. They're ridiculous.
And you have got to realize there is so much about our president we don't know about. We don't know who or what he deals with every day. Of course he has to keep some things hush hush. All presidents have. and plus, most people agree (from polls I've seen) that some things are better left secret to our government because of the fear and chaos it would cause the people. It would make problems harder to deal with.
Edit: I do have to admit, this is much more believable and plausible than the usual crap I get from like, 9/11 conspiracies and those stupid JFK ones. :-))
Yeah, I can definitely agree that Saddam was just as bad.
@-)
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